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enamelling on steel

• Andrew Findlay

  
   

  July 6, 2015

  Hi everyone I am a noob to enamelling but not to metalwork. I would love to be able to enamel something like the flower attached, but I see various problems. The thickness of the (zero carbon) steel varies from 1/8th inch towards the centre of the petals to very thin at the edge, and there is the rivet in the centre. It would be possible to disassemble it prior to enamelling. The flower is about 4 inches" diameter. My question is,  is it feasable to enamel something like this with varying thickness? Would it be a torch firing job or could in be done in a large kiln? My preparation would be to sandblast it followed by a steel groundcoat as supplied by WG Ball, would this be the right way to go? Many Thanks- Andrew

  Hi everyone I am a noob to enamelling but not to metalwork. I would love to be able to enamel something like the flower attached, but I see various problems. The thickness of the (zero carbon) steel varies from 1/8th inch towards the centre of the petals to very thin at the edge, and there is the rivet in the centre. It would be possible to disassemble it prior to enamelling. The flower is about 4 inches" diameter. My question is,  is it feasable to enamel something like this with varying thickness? Would it be a torch firing job or could in be done in a large kiln? My preparation would be to sandblast it followed by a steel groundcoat as supplied by WG Ball, would this be the right way to go? Many Thanks- Andrew

• Trish White

  

  Leader
   

  July 10, 2015

  HI Andrew,

  I am going to refer this big question to Charles Winkel, who works in steel and large pieces all the time.

  HI Andrew,

  I am going to refer this big question to Charles Winkel, who works in steel and large pieces all the time.

• Andrew Findlay

  
   

  July 10, 2015

  Thank you very much Trish!

   

  Thank you very much Trish!

   

• Charles Winkel

  

  Member
   

  July 11, 2015

  Mr. Findlay, I hope I can help. My name is Charles Winkel, and I work with 22 gage cold rolled steel. My projects are larg wall and floor projects. If you go to my album I have flowers you might find interesting. Trish has posted an article I wrote on steel preperation for enameling. I have invented a process for cleaning and applying the ground coat which will be very benificial toyou. First clean with a clean rag. Then what you you want to do is sand your steel with a vibrating sander using 80 grit sand paper. After the froject is formed clean the project with Awesome (R) and Comet (R). This is a must to really clean the steel properly. After cleaning don't touch the steel with your bear hands, use gloves from now on. I use Thompsons ground goat GC-16. I use a detail spray gun to apply the ground coat. It should be a consistancey of milk. PSI 30-40. Moving your side to side about 2' away. Apply 3 light coats drying between each application. Start with the bottom first, turn the project over and apply the the ground coat to the top, apply the ground coat the same way you applied the ground to the bottom. The project is now ready for firing. Fire at 1500 degrees for 3 minutes. If you cleaned the project properly, the ground will come out perfect, and very light.  You can now apply your black base white grainuler and other enamels at a light consistancy. You will still be able to keep the flower looking very delicate. Remember to read my article steel preperation. Thank you for your enquiry, and I hope this will help. Thank you

  Charles

  Mr. Findlay, I hope I can help. My name is Charles Winkel, and I work with 22 gage cold rolled steel. My projects are larg wall and floor projects. If you go to my album I have flowers you might find interesting. Trish has posted an article I wrote on steel preperation for enameling. I have invented a process for cleaning and applying the ground coat which will be very benificial toyou. First clean with a clean rag. Then what you you want to do is sand your steel with a vibrating sander using 80 grit sand paper. After the froject is formed clean the project with Awesome (R) and Comet (R). This is a must to really clean the steel properly. After cleaning don't touch the steel with your bear hands, use gloves from now on. I use Thompsons ground goat GC-16. I use a detail spray gun to apply the ground coat. It should be a consistancey of milk. PSI 30-40. Moving your side to side about 2' away. Apply 3 light coats drying between each application. Start with the bottom first, turn the project over and apply the the ground coat to the top, apply the ground coat the same way you applied the ground to the bottom. The project is now ready for firing. Fire at 1500 degrees for 3 minutes. If you cleaned the project properly, the ground will come out perfect, and very light.  You can now apply your black base white grainuler and other enamels at a light consistancy. You will still be able to keep the flower looking very delicate. Remember to read my article steel preperation. Thank you for your enquiry, and I hope this will help. Thank you

  Charles

• Andrew Findlay

  
   

  July 12, 2015

  Thank you very much Charles, that is very interesting and informative, especially the preparation aspect. I will give it a try and see if I can get a good result. Thanks again - Andrew

  Thank you very much Charles, that is very interesting and informative, especially the preparation aspect. I will give it a try and see if I can get a good result. Thanks again - Andrew

• Charles Winkel

  

  Member
   

  July 12, 2015

  Hi Mr. Findlay, It's me again, Charles. The article I was talking about in called Steel Preperation, and it can be found in Liquid Enamels un der Steel Preperation. Hopes this helps. If your having trouble with an existing project, try to clean it with the recomendation I gave you. This should save the the project your on at present. Washing the oils and other impurieties off the metal will prier to enameling will cure a host of problems. I know this sounds a little consided, but I spent 5 years comming up with this preperation, and it works. If you ever have a problem part way through the enameling process, try rewashing the project and then resume applying the enamel and firing. Have fun, and don't ever give up. There is always an answer to a problem, it just may take a little longer. Charles

  Hi Mr. Findlay, It's me again, Charles. The article I was talking about in called Steel Preperation, and it can be found in Liquid Enamels un der Steel Preperation. Hopes this helps. If your having trouble with an existing project, try to clean it with the recomendation I gave you. This should save the the project your on at present. Washing the oils and other impurieties off the metal will prier to enameling will cure a host of problems. I know this sounds a little consided, but I spent 5 years comming up with this preperation, and it works. If you ever have a problem part way through the enameling process, try rewashing the project and then resume applying the enamel and firing. Have fun, and don't ever give up. There is always an answer to a problem, it just may take a little longer. Charles

• Trish White

  

  Leader
   

  July 13, 2015

  Hi Andrew,

  In case you can't find the article on Steel Preparation by Charles Winkel, go to "Groups,"  and click on it, scroll the pages until you find the group "Liquid Enamel' and click on it - you will see the article.

  Trish

  Hi Andrew,

  In case you can't find the article on Steel Preparation by Charles Winkel, go to "Groups,"  and click on it, scroll the pages until you find the group "Liquid Enamel' and click on it - you will see the article.

  Trish

• Andrew Findlay

  
   

  July 15, 2015

  Thank you for your help Trish, hopefully I will be doing some sample pieces soon

  Thank you for your help Trish, hopefully I will be doing some sample pieces soon

• Charles Winkel

  

  Member
   

  September 1, 2015

  Hi Andrew, Charles Winkel here. I thought I would contact you and find out how your doing with your steel wprk. Did the the prep work on the steel eliminate your problems? If not not, please let me know what your having problems with and maybe i can help you with solving the problems.  Steel is great to work with and once you have mastered the prep, you love the finished peoduct. I will enjoy helping you in any way I can. You can also contact me at cwbrick61@yahoo.com if you want to contact me direct. Good luck, and I wish you sucess with the steel. I use 22 gage cold roled steel in my work. This steel is is the easest to work with. The hammering warms up the steel making it easer to form, but it is essential to clean it properly.

  Charles

  Hi Andrew, Charles Winkel here. I thought I would contact you and find out how your doing with your steel wprk. Did the the prep work on the steel eliminate your problems? If not not, please let me know what your having problems with and maybe i can help you with solving the problems.  Steel is great to work with and once you have mastered the prep, you love the finished peoduct. I will enjoy helping you in any way I can. You can also contact me at cwbrick61@yahoo.com if you want to contact me direct. Good luck, and I wish you sucess with the steel. I use 22 gage cold roled steel in my work. This steel is is the easest to work with. The hammering warms up the steel making it easer to form, but it is essential to clean it properly.

  Charles

• Andrew Findlay

  
   

  September 4, 2015

  Hi Charles

  Thank you very much for asking about my progress with enamelling on steel and sorry for my late reply I have been away.

  I have had some success, and cleaned the metal thouroughly after hot forging, but my metalworking technique requires me to forge the texture at a yellow heat into 1/8th inch thick steel with a hammer and then thin out the edges, as per the flower above. Then it is cooled and prepared for enamelling.  

  This variable cross section means that in the enamelling furnace the edges heat up before the middle and consequently are over fired while waiting for the enamel in the middle to get hot enough. I am going to try sandblasting the component to get off all the millscale and the degrease it and wash thouroughly as suggested. I am thinking also of trying to torch fire them, more control of the heat than a furnace. Unfortunately I am very busy with a large metalwork commission so may be a couple of months before I get time to try again, but will post on here when I do.

   

  Thanks again

   

  Andrew

  Hi Charles

  Thank you very much for asking about my progress with enamelling on steel and sorry for my late reply I have been away.

  I have had some success, and cleaned the metal thouroughly after hot forging, but my metalworking technique requires me to forge the texture at a yellow heat into 1/8th inch thick steel with a hammer and then thin out the edges, as per the flower above. Then it is cooled and prepared for enamelling.  

  This variable cross section means that in the enamelling furnace the edges heat up before the middle and consequently are over fired while waiting for the enamel in the middle to get hot enough. I am going to try sandblasting the component to get off all the millscale and the degrease it and wash thouroughly as suggested. I am thinking also of trying to torch fire them, more control of the heat than a furnace. Unfortunately I am very busy with a large metalwork commission so may be a couple of months before I get time to try again, but will post on here when I do.

   

  Thanks again

   

  Andrew